The Righteous Prevail.
The dispute is resolved.
I won.
oDesk Notification
12/27/2014
oDesk has reviewed the work diary for this contract and determined that all time was logged in accordance with theoDesk Payment Guarantee.
Time was auto-tracked with the necessary work memos and activity levels, and therefore the client is not eligible for a refund.
oDesk strongly recommends that you review our freelancer Dispute Policy to avoid future disputes. The primary consideration in resolving disputes is evaluating the work diary against the criteria of the oDesk Payment Guarantee. However, oDesk retains the right to withhold payment if a user is in violation of the oDesk Marketplace Agreement. Excessive disputes may result in account suspension.
If you would like to speak with a dispute resolution specialist about how to prevent future disputes, please contact us via this link.
Time was auto-tracked with the necessary work memos and activity levels, and therefore the client is not eligible for a refund.
oDesk strongly recommends that you review our freelancer Dispute Policy to avoid future disputes. The primary consideration in resolving disputes is evaluating the work diary against the criteria of the oDesk Payment Guarantee. However, oDesk retains the right to withhold payment if a user is in violation of the oDesk Marketplace Agreement. Excessive disputes may result in account suspension.
If you would like to speak with a dispute resolution specialist about how to prevent future disputes, please contact us via this link.
Complete Details
With respect to dispute #3552515:
* Contract: (+18 Adult Content) Describe / Tag / Title Videos Part-Time $100/Mo
* Company: Video Descriptions
* Disputed Hours: 01:00
* Rate: $9.99
* Reason for Dispute: Excessive hours logged
* click here to view the dispute
this is confirmation that you have *rejected* the dispute.
During the next 48 hours, oDesk will examine the freelancer Work Diary log and make a decision according to theoDesk dispute resolution policy.
If you are able to resolve the issue with the client directly please request they close the dispute.
=== FAQ ===
* How can I ensure a successful completion to a contract?
* Can my feedback be removed?
* What does oDesk look at when mediating a dispute?
=== Discussion thread ===
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-26-2014 06:32:52 PM
You still do not acknowledge the task you gave after presenting the quote you asked for. You're just being stubborn and unreasonable.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-26-2014 05:29:09 AM
Let's see what Odesk team decide, if that quote was the contract between us.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-26-2014 03:38:57 AM
I see you have seen the quote you asked for and you have nothing more to say. Why don't you drop the dispute and save them the trouble of going through this mess. Clearly you have made an error in filing this dispute. You may have been led by your emotions rather than thinking it through with your brain. You may have just forgotten that you gave me a task for 100 vids and thought I over billed you. Whatever the reason is, I will leave it at that.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-26-2014 12:17:49 AM
Let's wait the decision.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 06:30:06 PM
[12/20/2014 11:38:08 PM] norqusi: you can add the next 50 and I will get them done before monday
[12/20/2014 11:38:26 PM] Andrei Andreescu: k
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-25-2014 07:47:10 AM
Then quote me when I set the task for 100 vids.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 06:32:07 AM
The initial task was set for 100 videos, 50 vids per oDesk hour no deadline was set except for the assumed completion in that work week. The Skype transcript will indicate the job was set for 50 and the additional 50 were to be added and he did some time later so for that work week it was 100 vids and they needed 2 oDesk hours which was billed but his refusal to let me complete led to this. Again, I would like to say that he did not end the contract, he paused it with the intent of having me remove the hour in dispute and continue on with the job without the oDesk payment guarantee (adding manual time only), I then ended the contract. Again, if he did not refuse completion we would not be in this mess. There is absolutely no "double time," the task needed 2 hours and that is all that was billed, Failure to complete was his fault for refusing my attempts to complete and accept my services.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-25-2014 02:13:12 AM
He keeps saying the task was 100 vids. There is no such thing in the contract. There is $11 for 50 vids.
He tracked 2 hours and did 58 vids then he asked me on skype to change the contract because he was sleepy when himself proposed this contract terms that i accepted.
So I ended immediately the contract. He should track for what he works not double time then ask for offline work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 01:09:17 AM
The task (100 vids) required needed 2 oDesk hours and that is what was billed but while completing the task he prevented me from doing so and here we are now. If I was only allowed to finish the task, the task would be done in the exact amount of time - no more no less. His assumption that I will bill him hours without designated tasks is erroneous and indicates his lack of understanding regarding the matter. He designated work that needed 2 oDesk hours and it was tracked and billed through guaranteed payment. It was not completed because he prevented me from getting it done. No further work was laid out and that concludes billing. The task is laid out, I bill the hours needed to complete the task and get the task done on deadline, it would have been done had it not been for him preventing me from doing so.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 11:37:54 PM
There is not a "agreed amount of oDesk hours". He wants me to accept 2 hours and to "finish the job". If he was doing 5 hours, the "agreed amount of oDesk hours" would be 5 and I had to accept further "off the clock" work from him - to "finish the job" - I don't think is fair him to decide what the job is and whatever the amount of time he wants to work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-24-2014 06:49:57 PM
If he had allowed me to finish the job "off the clock," which I was doing at the time he paused the contract, the job would have been done in the agreed amount of oDesk hours but by his refusal and not allowing me to continue working on it, he has created the over billing situation himself. To add and to reiterate he does not want me to use the time tracker so an hour worked is not an hour paid, rather he wants to circumvent that oDesk privilege by requiring manual time and that is not guaranteed payment.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 09:21:16 AM
What he says here:
"He does not want to acknowledge that the work that was done tracked on the oDesk time tracker is the issue"
- is not true, in fact I acknowledge that the work that was done on the oDesk time tracker is the issue.
It's only half that had to be done in that time he tracked and I'm asking him to cut one hour because he tracked double time for the amount of work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-24-2014 06:04:05 AM
He does not want to acknowledge that the work that was done tracked on the oDesk time tracker is the issue and yet he brings it up again and still it shows in his last statement, " ...I don't think anyone should bill before and force the client to accept his further work."
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 04:14:27 AM
Norman says 'the task has to be done'. The task is what he can do in the logged time in terms of contract. He worked 2 logged hours what the contract states needs to be done in only 1 hour.
I told him I prefer the hours to be added manually - which was accepted before contract started and refused only after. But that being "the real cause for my action" is incorrect. My dispute cause is he doesn't want to delete 1 logged hour.
He wants me to compel to accept his further work for 1 billed hour and he wants to work with clock off until he reaches the terms.
But I don't want to work with him anymore, first because he asked to change the contract on skype and he said he was sleepy when he proposed the terms of contract that I accepted. And second I don't think anyone should bill before and force the client to accept his further work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-23-2014 05:37:13 PM
My former client points out that there is an issue with billing but if the task needed a certain amount of oDesk hours and the job was to be completed in the said amount of time with no expressed deadline other than the assumed completion in that work week, the task has been done to spec. Payment is then rightfully due for services rendered under hourly oDesk contracts and assured through the oDesk time tracker which I did. My former client has a problem with this and he keeps on bringing it up in the dispute and as I have stated previously, he preferred to have the time added manually to circumvent that oDesk privilege which I was not about to give up.This is the real cause for action of my previous client.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-23-2014 04:14:41 AM
Quote from Skype transcript:
----------------------------------
[12/21/2014 7:20:45 PM] norqusi: it may be billed in advance as you say but it does not mean I will not complete the task
----------------------------------
Quote from normansodesk Dec 23, 2014 9:35am UTC:
-----------------------------------
The terms were 50 vids 1 oDesk hour and I fully intended to complete the task but he refused to let me complete it.
-----------------------------------
I think is clear. You can't bill before work done and compel employer to accept your work in advance.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-23-2014 01:35:59 AM
He had the option to decline the terms I was renegotiating. There was no mention from me that the work was not going to be done as agreed. The terms were 50 vids 1 oDesk hour and I fully intended to complete the task but he refused to let me complete it. True, there was an offer to add hours manually which was OK but hourly contracts are not meant to be set for manual time only. Hourly jobs are always tracked through the time tracker for guaranteed payment and optionally freelancers are allowed to enter time worked manually which is only paid upon approval from the client and I am not about to allow a client make me lose that oDesk privilege. By jumping the gun and assuming that I would not do the job according to the original terms, we are now here in this mess. The only reason why there were only 58 vids completed is because of his refusal to let me complete it. I am still open to completing the remainder of the vids but I do not wish to work for him ever again. A transcript of the Skype conversation we had from the start is attached.
Cheers,
Norman
To retrieve the attachment click here:
https://www.odesk.com/ticketatt.php?key=~~2bffdea39031ee9e
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-22-2014 10:07:05 PM
What contractor says "We had an agreement that 100 vid descriptions were to be done" is incorrect.
The contract was not defined by any number on vids. It happens that 100 new vids were just uploaded in my script at that time. And I told him every time he's finishing 50 I will upload another new 50 vids.
He forgot to say he proposed different terms of contract before even finishing that 100 vids he's talking about.
I told him if he can add hours manually. He didn't refused that at first. He just asked me to increase the payment per hour at $10 so his target per hour will be 50 vids. He worked 2 hours and did 58 vids.
Then he asked me to change the contract so he can earn $135 for 500 vids.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-22-2014 03:45:30 PM
The client is not disputing the hours because I "logged double time". We had an agreement that 100 vid descriptions were to be done, I logged the hours on the oDesk tracker but the job was done halfway at this point, I was going to do the rest of the task "off the clock" when he paused the contract and refused to let me finish the task. He misunderstood the contract renegotiation I proposed but it was not really that, he wants to have me enter manual time instead of tracking my hours on the oDesk time tracker. I have a complete transcript of our argument on Skype. He called it "billing in advance."
He also did not end the contract immediately, I did that, upon reaching the conclusion that he was unwilling to use the oDesk time tracker, I ended the contract. Why would I subject myself to a contract that has no payment guarantee. I work on oDesk solely because of the guarantee that "an hour worked is an hour paid." You can verify the whole thing either through the transcript he has or I can provide that too. I have never over billed any of my clients, I do slack off sometimes and do other things at home while logged on the tracker, like take care of my daughter, but that is all part of what makes working at home ideal - you get to work while you stay with your family. All contractual obligations are always met and I do not add the time required to finish them. The agreed output in the agreed upon oDesk hours - always.
I hope for your just resolution of the matter and to end my response, may I just emphasize, just to have you know what kind of client the guy is, he does not want oDesk workers using the time tracker on hourly jobs. What reason does he have other than to circumvent the payment guarantee?
BTW, please tell me if you need the transcript of the Skype conversation me and the client had.
Cheers,
Norman
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-22-2014 06:27:55 AM
Hi, I would want to fill a dispute because the freelancer logged double time for the work he done and he asked me on skype to change the contract so he can earn more.
I ended this contract immediately and I asked him to delete an hour and he said he wants to work more without logging more time but I don't trust him anymore after asking for more money, i won't let him log in my script again.
I can provide script login for you to see his work and teamviewer so you can see what we talked on skype.
Best regards,
Andrei
* Contract: (+18 Adult Content) Describe / Tag / Title Videos Part-Time $100/Mo
* Company: Video Descriptions
* Disputed Hours: 01:00
* Rate: $9.99
* Reason for Dispute: Excessive hours logged
* click here to view the dispute
this is confirmation that you have *rejected* the dispute.
During the next 48 hours, oDesk will examine the freelancer Work Diary log and make a decision according to theoDesk dispute resolution policy.
If you are able to resolve the issue with the client directly please request they close the dispute.
=== FAQ ===
* How can I ensure a successful completion to a contract?
* Can my feedback be removed?
* What does oDesk look at when mediating a dispute?
=== Discussion thread ===
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-26-2014 06:32:52 PM
You still do not acknowledge the task you gave after presenting the quote you asked for. You're just being stubborn and unreasonable.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-26-2014 05:29:09 AM
Let's see what Odesk team decide, if that quote was the contract between us.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-26-2014 03:38:57 AM
I see you have seen the quote you asked for and you have nothing more to say. Why don't you drop the dispute and save them the trouble of going through this mess. Clearly you have made an error in filing this dispute. You may have been led by your emotions rather than thinking it through with your brain. You may have just forgotten that you gave me a task for 100 vids and thought I over billed you. Whatever the reason is, I will leave it at that.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-26-2014 12:17:49 AM
Let's wait the decision.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 06:30:06 PM
[12/20/2014 11:38:08 PM] norqusi: you can add the next 50 and I will get them done before monday
[12/20/2014 11:38:26 PM] Andrei Andreescu: k
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-25-2014 07:47:10 AM
Then quote me when I set the task for 100 vids.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 06:32:07 AM
The initial task was set for 100 videos, 50 vids per oDesk hour no deadline was set except for the assumed completion in that work week. The Skype transcript will indicate the job was set for 50 and the additional 50 were to be added and he did some time later so for that work week it was 100 vids and they needed 2 oDesk hours which was billed but his refusal to let me complete led to this. Again, I would like to say that he did not end the contract, he paused it with the intent of having me remove the hour in dispute and continue on with the job without the oDesk payment guarantee (adding manual time only), I then ended the contract. Again, if he did not refuse completion we would not be in this mess. There is absolutely no "double time," the task needed 2 hours and that is all that was billed, Failure to complete was his fault for refusing my attempts to complete and accept my services.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-25-2014 02:13:12 AM
He keeps saying the task was 100 vids. There is no such thing in the contract. There is $11 for 50 vids.
He tracked 2 hours and did 58 vids then he asked me on skype to change the contract because he was sleepy when himself proposed this contract terms that i accepted.
So I ended immediately the contract. He should track for what he works not double time then ask for offline work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-25-2014 01:09:17 AM
The task (100 vids) required needed 2 oDesk hours and that is what was billed but while completing the task he prevented me from doing so and here we are now. If I was only allowed to finish the task, the task would be done in the exact amount of time - no more no less. His assumption that I will bill him hours without designated tasks is erroneous and indicates his lack of understanding regarding the matter. He designated work that needed 2 oDesk hours and it was tracked and billed through guaranteed payment. It was not completed because he prevented me from getting it done. No further work was laid out and that concludes billing. The task is laid out, I bill the hours needed to complete the task and get the task done on deadline, it would have been done had it not been for him preventing me from doing so.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 11:37:54 PM
There is not a "agreed amount of oDesk hours". He wants me to accept 2 hours and to "finish the job". If he was doing 5 hours, the "agreed amount of oDesk hours" would be 5 and I had to accept further "off the clock" work from him - to "finish the job" - I don't think is fair him to decide what the job is and whatever the amount of time he wants to work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-24-2014 06:49:57 PM
If he had allowed me to finish the job "off the clock," which I was doing at the time he paused the contract, the job would have been done in the agreed amount of oDesk hours but by his refusal and not allowing me to continue working on it, he has created the over billing situation himself. To add and to reiterate he does not want me to use the time tracker so an hour worked is not an hour paid, rather he wants to circumvent that oDesk privilege by requiring manual time and that is not guaranteed payment.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 09:21:16 AM
What he says here:
"He does not want to acknowledge that the work that was done tracked on the oDesk time tracker is the issue"
- is not true, in fact I acknowledge that the work that was done on the oDesk time tracker is the issue.
It's only half that had to be done in that time he tracked and I'm asking him to cut one hour because he tracked double time for the amount of work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-24-2014 06:04:05 AM
He does not want to acknowledge that the work that was done tracked on the oDesk time tracker is the issue and yet he brings it up again and still it shows in his last statement, " ...I don't think anyone should bill before and force the client to accept his further work."
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-24-2014 04:14:27 AM
Norman says 'the task has to be done'. The task is what he can do in the logged time in terms of contract. He worked 2 logged hours what the contract states needs to be done in only 1 hour.
I told him I prefer the hours to be added manually - which was accepted before contract started and refused only after. But that being "the real cause for my action" is incorrect. My dispute cause is he doesn't want to delete 1 logged hour.
He wants me to compel to accept his further work for 1 billed hour and he wants to work with clock off until he reaches the terms.
But I don't want to work with him anymore, first because he asked to change the contract on skype and he said he was sleepy when he proposed the terms of contract that I accepted. And second I don't think anyone should bill before and force the client to accept his further work.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-23-2014 05:37:13 PM
My former client points out that there is an issue with billing but if the task needed a certain amount of oDesk hours and the job was to be completed in the said amount of time with no expressed deadline other than the assumed completion in that work week, the task has been done to spec. Payment is then rightfully due for services rendered under hourly oDesk contracts and assured through the oDesk time tracker which I did. My former client has a problem with this and he keeps on bringing it up in the dispute and as I have stated previously, he preferred to have the time added manually to circumvent that oDesk privilege which I was not about to give up.This is the real cause for action of my previous client.
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-23-2014 04:14:41 AM
Quote from Skype transcript:
----------------------------------
[12/21/2014 7:20:45 PM] norqusi: it may be billed in advance as you say but it does not mean I will not complete the task
----------------------------------
Quote from normansodesk Dec 23, 2014 9:35am UTC:
-----------------------------------
The terms were 50 vids 1 oDesk hour and I fully intended to complete the task but he refused to let me complete it.
-----------------------------------
I think is clear. You can't bill before work done and compel employer to accept your work in advance.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-23-2014 01:35:59 AM
He had the option to decline the terms I was renegotiating. There was no mention from me that the work was not going to be done as agreed. The terms were 50 vids 1 oDesk hour and I fully intended to complete the task but he refused to let me complete it. True, there was an offer to add hours manually which was OK but hourly contracts are not meant to be set for manual time only. Hourly jobs are always tracked through the time tracker for guaranteed payment and optionally freelancers are allowed to enter time worked manually which is only paid upon approval from the client and I am not about to allow a client make me lose that oDesk privilege. By jumping the gun and assuming that I would not do the job according to the original terms, we are now here in this mess. The only reason why there were only 58 vids completed is because of his refusal to let me complete it. I am still open to completing the remainder of the vids but I do not wish to work for him ever again. A transcript of the Skype conversation we had from the start is attached.
Cheers,
Norman
To retrieve the attachment click here:
https://www.odesk.com/ticketatt.php?key=~~2bffdea39031ee9e
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-22-2014 10:07:05 PM
What contractor says "We had an agreement that 100 vid descriptions were to be done" is incorrect.
The contract was not defined by any number on vids. It happens that 100 new vids were just uploaded in my script at that time. And I told him every time he's finishing 50 I will upload another new 50 vids.
He forgot to say he proposed different terms of contract before even finishing that 100 vids he's talking about.
I told him if he can add hours manually. He didn't refused that at first. He just asked me to increase the payment per hour at $10 so his target per hour will be 50 vids. He worked 2 hours and did 58 vids.
Then he asked me to change the contract so he can earn $135 for 500 vids.
----
From: norman simbulan - 12-22-2014 03:45:30 PM
The client is not disputing the hours because I "logged double time". We had an agreement that 100 vid descriptions were to be done, I logged the hours on the oDesk tracker but the job was done halfway at this point, I was going to do the rest of the task "off the clock" when he paused the contract and refused to let me finish the task. He misunderstood the contract renegotiation I proposed but it was not really that, he wants to have me enter manual time instead of tracking my hours on the oDesk time tracker. I have a complete transcript of our argument on Skype. He called it "billing in advance."
He also did not end the contract immediately, I did that, upon reaching the conclusion that he was unwilling to use the oDesk time tracker, I ended the contract. Why would I subject myself to a contract that has no payment guarantee. I work on oDesk solely because of the guarantee that "an hour worked is an hour paid." You can verify the whole thing either through the transcript he has or I can provide that too. I have never over billed any of my clients, I do slack off sometimes and do other things at home while logged on the tracker, like take care of my daughter, but that is all part of what makes working at home ideal - you get to work while you stay with your family. All contractual obligations are always met and I do not add the time required to finish them. The agreed output in the agreed upon oDesk hours - always.
I hope for your just resolution of the matter and to end my response, may I just emphasize, just to have you know what kind of client the guy is, he does not want oDesk workers using the time tracker on hourly jobs. What reason does he have other than to circumvent the payment guarantee?
BTW, please tell me if you need the transcript of the Skype conversation me and the client had.
Cheers,
Norman
----
From: andrei nicolae - 12-22-2014 06:27:55 AM
Hi, I would want to fill a dispute because the freelancer logged double time for the work he done and he asked me on skype to change the contract so he can earn more.
I ended this contract immediately and I asked him to delete an hour and he said he wants to work more without logging more time but I don't trust him anymore after asking for more money, i won't let him log in my script again.
I can provide script login for you to see his work and teamviewer so you can see what we talked on skype.
Best regards,
Andrei
